New solar scope build advice needed

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New solar scope build advice needed

Post by Grakrob778 »

Hello,

I am starting a new thread on this forum to get some more insight on my new Ha solar scope build. I would appreciate some advice.
I have ordered the Tecnosky 102 F/11 refractor from Teleskop-Express. I have placed a deposit on a Solar Spectrum RG18 0.3A filter through Alpine Astro in the USA. Planning on a Baader 110 D-ERF for the front with cell from Alpine when I receive the telescope, and measure the dew shield OD.

Reading elsewhere on the internet and doing some parts availability research, I have noticed there are quite a bit of Astro products out of stock. I found a Baader TZ-4 telecentric and bought it from Agena Astro. It was the last one. Then ordered the Baader M68 Tele-Compendium Set for a more rigid system, and finally a Baader 2 inch Clicklock Diagonal. I'm not sure if the telescope's focuser is adequate enough to handle the weight or if it is threaded for the M68 kit. I still have a long way to go before getting the scope or the filter but with parts so low I think buying now makes sense.

It would nice to binoview through this setup, and think I will need the SS 0.4x reducer for full disc? Can I use this reducer visually or is it only photographically intended? Do I need the reducer? I have the ASI 1600MM and 174MM cameras.

Are there any other parts I will need to complete the imaging train? And finally, by keeping a F/44 beam coming into the filter will this telescope setup be a good system for imaging and viewing through? Any advice appreciated. Especially on image sampling and visual expectations or parts still needed.

Thank you for your time and efforts. Graham


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Re: New solar scope build advice needed

Post by Valery »

Grakrob778 wrote: Fri Jul 09, 2021 10:44 pm Hello,

I am starting a new thread on this forum to get some more insight on my new Ha solar scope build. I would appreciate some advice.
I have ordered the Tecnosky 102 F/11 refractor from Teleskop-Express. I have placed a deposit on a Solar Spectrum RG18 0.3A filter through Alpine Astro in the USA. Planning on a Baader 110 D-ERF for the front with cell from Alpine when I receive the telescope, and measure the dew shield OD.

Reading elsewhere on the internet and doing some parts availability research, I have noticed there are quite a bit of Astro products out of stock. I found a Baader TZ-4 telecentric and bought it from Agena Astro. It was the last one. Then ordered the Baader M68 Tele-Compendium Set for a more rigid system, and finally a Baader 2 inch Clicklock Diagonal. I'm not sure if the telescope's focuser is adequate enough to handle the weight or if it is threaded for the M68 kit. I still have a long way to go before getting the scope or the filter but with parts so low I think buying now makes sense.

It would nice to binoview through this setup, and think I will need the SS 0.4x reducer for full disc? Can I use this reducer visually or is it only photographically intended? Do I need the reducer? I have the ASI 1600MM and 174MM cameras.

Are there any other parts I will need to complete the imaging train? And finally, by keeping a F/44 beam coming into the filter will this telescope setup be a good system for imaging and viewing through? Any advice appreciated. Especially on image sampling and visual expectations or parts still needed.

Thank you for your time and efforts. Graham
IMHO, such a step ahead in aperture from Coronado SM3/2 90mm DS to 102mm refractor + RG18 is just a money waste.
Double staked 90mm will easily eat even best 0.3A single stack etalon on a 102mm aperture.
You need a 150mm refractor for a real step ahead.


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Re: New solar scope build advice needed

Post by Grakrob778 »

Valery,
Thanks for input. Still at 102mm F/11 with 4x Baader telecentric, SS @ 0.3A will be at 0.3A, not 0.5A. I'm interested in being at 6562.8 A @ 0.3A. Visually 90mm DS is very good. I want to see what 0.3A looks like being on band.
Respect to you,
Graham


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Re: New solar scope build advice needed

Post by Grakrob778 »

Valery,
I am taking your advice along with Bart's opinion and have changed my mind..
I sent Teleskop-Express an email asking if they can cancel the order and apply the credits towards a Bresser 152/1200mm instead. Hopefully that will work.

Thanks,
Graham


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Re: New solar scope build advice needed

Post by Rusted »

Graham,

You haven't mentioned your mounting for this increase in aperture.
The 150mm f/8s are quite heavy and long enough to need some extra height.
Otherwise you end up limbo dancing to get near the eyepiece.
My own 6" f/8 sat on a heavy steel pier. With the mounting about 7' high to the crossing of the axes.
Even then I had an observing chair to be able to sit when the telescope was pointed high.
I used a vintage mounting so can't advise on suitable modern mountings.
I have never owned one.
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Re: New solar scope build advice needed

Post by Grakrob778 »

Hello Rusted!

Sorry for just seeing this. So, I have an EQ6-R mount. The mount will either be placed in my ROR observatory which has 900 pounds of concrete in the ground and a 12" diameter pier or on my Berlebach planet tripod. I have four, 1/2 x 4.5 inch concrete anchors holding down my pier to mount adapter, made of 1/4 inch steel, that has been welded and painted matte black with rusto paint. The pier height is about 46 inches high off the floor.

I have made all my purchases and am in process of sitting back and waiting for them to arrive. I went with the Bresser 152/1200mm f/7.9 refractor. I will be removing the dew shield and placing a Baader 135mm D-ERF on the front. D-ERF coming Thursday. For the focuser, I will be removing the OEM, and replacing with 2 inch Baader Diamond Steeltrack (coming tomorrow). I have the adapter plate already. After that I have the Baader M68 Tele-Compendium kit, with the TZ-4. Also, I have a 2 inch Baader 35nm filter I will try in front of the focuser tube. I have also coming the SS 0.7x and SS 0.4x reducers with two Baader universal flange adapters for SS filter connection. I did not buy the BBHS mirror diagonal, but have the 2 inch Clickstop instead. I hope that doesn't matter much. I have a few Clickstop adapters coming too. Looking up through this post there are a lot of I's lol. Sorry. I'm not really about I, just we matters.

My plan is to use the M68 kit to thread directly to the Baader focuser, even if the S.S. RG18 filter is "light", the train is so long I do not want sag. So it will be rigid as possible. This remains to be seen if it can be done with what I have coming. The only things on this telescope that will not be Baader brand is the lens cell and the tube. I wanted high quality coming from the Meade scope. My cameras are the ASI 174MM and 1600MM Pro.

I understand the weight of the OTA is 11.1Kg. The Meade DS scope was more. But it really doesn't matter to me if it goes on the pier. Just waiting on my filter from Solar Spectrum and D-ERF cell to be complete. Feedback welcomed including "constructive" criticism. LOL

Graham


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Re: New solar scope build advice needed

Post by Rusted »

Grakrob778 wrote: Wed Jul 21, 2021 4:42 am Hello Rusted!

Feedback welcomed including "constructive" criticism. LOL

Graham
You seem to have everything under control. :D


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Re: New solar scope build advice needed

Post by Valery »

Graham,

Better to return the 135mm DERF and add some monet and get a 160mm with a free 150mm aperture. In this case all your investments will work at 100% potential of your setup.
Also images will be brighter with the same magnifications.


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Re: New solar scope build advice needed

Post by Grakrob778 »

Valery wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 2:32 am Graham,

Better to return the 135mm DERF and add some monet and get a 160mm with a free 150mm aperture. In this case all your investments will work at 100% potential of your setup.
Also images will be brighter with the same magnifications.


Valery
Hey Valery,

I had to change telescope choice at last minute and now have it. Went with Skywatcher Evo 150. Can't afford the 160 at the moment :) I think the 135 will be fine for now, upgrade later. I could always place it sub-aperture though..

Thank you for your advice,
Graham


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Re: New solar scope build advice needed

Post by RKBerta »

You mentioned you weren't going to get the BAADER BBHS diagonal....that was a smart decision. While BAADER doesn't widely advertise the warning but I have a copy from them....they say it shouldn't be used with Ha as it passes radiation to the users eye that normal diagonals and the regular click lock diagonal doesn't.
I have both that BBHS diagonal and an Astro Physics which is OK fore Ha. The BAADER is superior for other viewing though....planets take on a gorgeous detailed view and DS is great also. The click lock is a very nice feature too.
I consider myself very lucky that I wasn't using the BBHS for Ha as my particular setup had a problem getting enough infocus on my favorite Ha setup so used the AP (the click stop on the BAADER adds a bit more back focus). I saw the BAADER warning about a year after I got it. A safety warning that important should have been included in the product specs!


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Re: New solar scope build advice needed

Post by Rusted »

Grakrob778 wrote: Fri Jul 30, 2021 2:55 pm
Valery wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 2:32 am Graham,

Better to return the 135mm DERF and add some money and get a 160mm with a free 150mm aperture. In this case all your investments will work at 100% potential of your setup. Also images will be brighter with the same magnifications.

Valery
Hey Valery,

I had to change telescope choice at last minute and now have it. Went with Skywatcher Evo 150. Can't afford the 160 at the moment :) I think the 135 will be fine for now, upgrade later. I could always place it sub-aperture though..

Thank you for your advice,
Graham
If you decide to place a sub-aperture, internal D-ERF then watch out for the fiercely hot, refocused beam exiting the objective!
It will burn, or set light, to anything which comes within a few inches of the front of the objective. Your face? Eyes? Hair? Hands? Hat?

Ask me how I know? I set light to a temporary, cardboard aperture stop. The observatory was full of smoke!
There were flames in the dew shield right up against the objective in its cell. Luckily I was there at the time.
I often leave the telescopes tracking the sun unattended while I fetch something from the workshop.
In a closed, rural observatory there is no risk to children or the curious. They have no access.

You should never leave a telescope unattended outside in daylight.
Even on an overcast day the sun could come out long enough to blind somebody permanently.

There is a serious risk with old-fashioned solar wedges. The beam exits the bottom of the wedge casing.
Just where a curious child might look up at the bright light.


http://fullerscopes.blogspot.dk/

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Re: New solar scope build advice needed

Post by Grakrob778 »

RKBerta wrote: Sat Jul 31, 2021 7:10 pm You mentioned you weren't going to get the BAADER BBHS diagonal....that was a smart decision. While BAADER doesn't widely advertise the warning but I have a copy from them....they say it shouldn't be used with Ha as it passes radiation to the users eye that normal diagonals and the regular click lock diagonal doesn't.
I have both that BBHS diagonal and an Astro Physics which is OK fore Ha. The BAADER is superior for other viewing though....planets take on a gorgeous detailed view and DS is great also. The click lock is a very nice feature too.
I consider myself very lucky that I wasn't using the BBHS for Ha as my particular setup had a problem getting enough infocus on my favorite Ha setup so used the AP (the click stop on the BAADER adds a bit more back focus). I saw the BAADER warning about a year after I got it. A safety warning that important should have been included in the product specs!
Thank you. I ran a test last night on the Baader Dielectric Clickstop diagonal with my ThunderOptics spectrometer. I was curious as to what spectrum it would reflect in the h-alpha range because Baader at one point had suggested using the BBHS for viewing H-alpha due to the broad spectrum of 390-2000nm. When I went back to look at that same webpage, the suggestion was removed and the page said last updated July 16th. After taking the spectrum of reflected light, I see this diagonal is okay for viewing H-alpha. It doesn't start cutting off until past 800nm.

See here: https://www.cloudynights.com/topic/7822 ... -spectrum/


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Re: New solar scope build advice needed

Post by Grakrob778 »

Rusted wrote: Sun Aug 01, 2021 5:39 pm
Grakrob778 wrote: Fri Jul 30, 2021 2:55 pm
Valery wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 2:32 am Graham,

Better to return the 135mm DERF and add some money and get a 160mm with a free 150mm aperture. In this case all your investments will work at 100% potential of your setup. Also images will be brighter with the same magnifications.

Valery
Hey Valery,

I had to change telescope choice at last minute and now have it. Went with Skywatcher Evo 150. Can't afford the 160 at the moment :) I think the 135 will be fine for now, upgrade later. I could always place it sub-aperture though..

Thank you for your advice,
Graham
If you decide to place a sub-aperture, internal D-ERF then watch out for the fiercely hot, refocused beam exiting the objective!
It will burn, or set light, to anything which comes within a few inches of the front of the objective. Your face? Eyes? Hair? Hands? Hat?

Ask me how I know? I set light to a temporary, cardboard aperture stop. The observatory was full of smoke!
There were flames in the dew shield right up against the objective in its cell. Luckily I was there at the time.
I often leave the telescopes tracking the sun unattended while I fetch something from the workshop.
In a closed, rural observatory there is no risk to children or the curious. They have no access.

You should never leave a telescope unattended outside in daylight.
Even on an overcast day the sun could come out long enough to blind somebody permanently.

There is a serious risk with old-fashioned solar wedges. The beam exits the bottom of the wedge casing.
Just where a curious child might look up at the bright light.
Hi and thank you for the advice. Reading in Christian's book, "Solar Astronomy" page 200 at top left suggests the ERF is to be at least 2/3 size of the objective and placed 1/3 the focal length from the objective. That there is no risk of filter rupture.
The fire experience is insane! I would have freaked out!! Glad you were there and prevented any further damage. I have ordered an older style Baader 2" wedge and filter set from a fellow in France last week. Hope it arrives soon. It has the exhaust tube for the light escape. I read on an older review there is no risk of burning your hand if placed in the hatch. I will be mindful of small children though. All our girls are 10 and over and they listen most of the time :)


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