More aperture please (PST)

this is the main message area for anything solar :)
Post Reply
Astrophil
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 903
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2018 2:00 am
Been thanked: 581 times

More aperture please (PST)

Post by Astrophil »

Hi all,

Please bear with me for a while, I’m trying to get my moneys worth out of this new solar scope and justify its purchase. Double stacking was not satisfactory and a mod 2 was even less impressive, so my plan is to get the most out of imaging with the stock PST. This will be old news for most here so feel free to send some tips my way.

I have some lower power Barlows arriving this week that should help match the image size to the Grasshopper camera. A 2.5x Powermate is too much for a full disk in one shot and mosaics are time consuming. I did find that using a short snout on the camera will come to focus but the image is small. Anyway, here are my first attempts at full disk imaging with the PST.

The first uses a 2.5x Powermate and a focal reducer (don’t laugh).
Second and third is with the short snout on the camera only.
Forth is a four panel mosaic using the 2.5x.
Fifth Is a greyscale version. I like it the best.

Thanks,
Phil
20190221_102309_L_g3_ap1624acc.jpg
20190221_102309_L_g3_ap1624acc.jpg (280.99 KiB) Viewed 2584 times
20190222_081745_L_g3_ap1542acc.jpg
20190222_081745_L_g3_ap1542acc.jpg (200.46 KiB) Viewed 2584 times
20190223_101822_acc.jpg
20190223_101822_acc.jpg (212.95 KiB) Viewed 2584 times
Mosaic feb 23cc.jpg
Mosaic feb 23cc.jpg (455.72 KiB) Viewed 2584 times
Mosaic feb 23cm.jpg
Mosaic feb 23cm.jpg (395.05 KiB) Viewed 2584 times


User avatar
Montana
Librarian
Librarian
Posts: 34563
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 5:25 pm
Location: Cheshire, UK
Has thanked: 17672 times
Been thanked: 8792 times

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by Montana »

The last couple of pics are the absolute best you are going to get with a 40mm, these are cracking :bow

Alexandra


User avatar
marktownley
Librarian
Librarian
Posts: 42274
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2011 5:27 pm
Location: Brierley Hills, UK
Has thanked: 20442 times
Been thanked: 10248 times
Contact:

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by marktownley »

Nice shots! It's just about finding the correct spacing of the barlow to the chip to fill the fov.


Image
http://brierleyhillsolar.blogspot.co.uk/
Solar images, a collection of all the most up to date live solar data on the web, imaging & processing tutorials - please take a look!
bart1805
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 636
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2017 9:04 pm
Location: The Netherlands
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by bart1805 »

4 and 5 are indeed beautiful! So please don't invest in a new barlow, but in time by making mosaics. (-;
Baader VIP barlow is really nice btw. You can change the distance by adding or removing T2 extensions.


User avatar
marktownley
Librarian
Librarian
Posts: 42274
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2011 5:27 pm
Location: Brierley Hills, UK
Has thanked: 20442 times
Been thanked: 10248 times
Contact:

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by marktownley »

One of these https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Short-C-Moun ... :rk:3:pf:0 and the nose off a 2x barlow should give you the image scale and focus you need to get a fuller frame.


Image
http://brierleyhillsolar.blogspot.co.uk/
Solar images, a collection of all the most up to date live solar data on the web, imaging & processing tutorials - please take a look!
User avatar
MapleRidge
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Posts: 10199
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 11:58 pm
Location: Cambray, ON Canada
Has thanked: 64 times
Been thanked: 4340 times
Contact:

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by MapleRidge »

Phil...

The FD's are good, and if you can get a barlow to boost the image scale a bit it will give you some great images.

The mosaics are very impressive but I agree they are a lot of work. For me, the FD on one frame are not meant to be super high-res, but a way to show the full disk and where features are relative to each other. Larger scopes can then be used to get the top end images.

Brian


Brian Colville

Maple Ridge Observatory
Cambray, ON Canada

Photos: https://www.flickr.com/photos/185395281@N08/albums

10'x15 Roll-off Roof Observatory
Takahashi EM400 Mount carrying:
C14 + Lunt 80ED
Deep Sky Work - ASI294MM Pro+EFW 7x36/Canon 60D (Ha mod), ONAG
Planetary Work - SBIG CFW10, ASI462MM

2.2m Diameter Dome
iOptron CEM70G Mount carrying:
Orion EON 130ED, f7 OTA for Day & Night Use
Ha Setup: Lunt LS80PT/LS75FHa/B1200Ha + Home Brew Lunt Double Stack/B1800Ha on the Orion OTA + Daystar Quantum
WL, G-Band & CaK Setup: Lunt Wedge & Lunt B1800CaK, Baader K-Line and Altair 2nm G-Band filter
ASI1600MM, ASI432MM, ASI294MM Pro, ASI174MM, ASI462MM
Astrophil
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 903
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2018 2:00 am
Been thanked: 581 times

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by Astrophil »

Thanks for the suggestions and comments. This is definitely the right place to ask. I agree that FD images are more for an overview of what's going on but some of the disk images I've seen here were spectacular. It might sound odd but at times I like to try to get the most from the least. I've had interesting results from an iPhone and 89mm scope using mosaics. (Link below)

If we get any solar activity soon, I will try another mosaic and a full frame disk image for comparison. You all already know the results but I want to see for myself.

Mark, thanks for the short c-mount link. I'll get one.

Reflected sunlight mosaic with small scope and phone

http://www.astrophil.com/astrophotos/iP ... n=download

Phil


User avatar
Christopher
Im an EXPERT!
Im an EXPERT!
Posts: 221
Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:07 am
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA
Has thanked: 33 times
Been thanked: 34 times

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by Christopher »

Astrophil wrote: Wed Feb 27, 2019 12:11 am It might sound odd but at times I like to try to get the most from the least. I've had interesting results from an iPhone and 89mm scope using mosaics. (Link below)
I know exactly what you mean Phil. I’m working on a similar project pairing up a SolarMax 40 with a Borg 45ED and iOptron SmartEQ Pro. Mount and scope together weigh what my Lunt 100 weighs unmounted. I’m thinking quick frame grabs when short on time and ultra-portability. But part of me is very focused on just achieving a satisfying result using a “minimalist” approach - if we can say it with a straight face 😐. I’d say you’re definitely on track to squeeze the most out of that PST. The B&W looks very nice. Love the cellphone moon shot also. I also have a Grasshopper and use that short c mount with just the nosepiece of a Coronado 2X Barlow. It works well. I’m interested to see your further results. As I get my rig together and get some sunshine I’ll try and post some results as well.
Cheers


Christopher

"Our imagination is stretched to the utmost, not, as in fiction, to imagine things which are not really there, but just to comprehend those things which 'are' there.". -Feynman
User avatar
MAURITS
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Posts: 8507
Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:37 pm
Location: Belgium
Has thanked: 2412 times
Been thanked: 4787 times
Contact:

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by MAURITS »

Top serie Phil ...


Regards,
Maurits

Vista del Cielo Observatory

www.vistadelcielo.be
User avatar
eroel
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Posts: 9408
Joined: Mon Dec 19, 2011 10:45 pm
Location: México D.F.
Been thanked: 4904 times

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by eroel »

Phil:
Your PST gives very good clean and even images, so the result you get with the 2.5 Powermate and a reducer at the camera nose gives a nice FD that can show what is going on the Sun, and if interesting you can make a FD mosaic or just a partial one of the interesting feature.
I use my 40mm Coronado etalons on a 76mm TeleVue, just to take FD´s, so when I see something interesting I make a mosaic or go for a bigger solar scope.
Try to get the best distance of the Barlow to the chip, so to get the best size possible for the used camera chip.
Beautiful clean and crisp mosaics shown.
Best regards,
Eric.


Astrophil
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 903
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2018 2:00 am
Been thanked: 581 times

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by Astrophil »

Christopher, with a straight face...indeed.

Thanks Maurits.

Eric, good info. I have a plan to follow. We'll see what happens.

Phil


User avatar
Christopher
Im an EXPERT!
Im an EXPERT!
Posts: 221
Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:07 am
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA
Has thanked: 33 times
Been thanked: 34 times

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by Christopher »

And finally....here's my "minimalist" set-up with an initial result. As I mentioned above it is a Borg 45ED which I've had for many years with an older pre-Meade Coronado SolarMax 40 and the Solar Sprectrum modified T-scanner. All riding on a mighty iOptron SmartEQ Pro+ with nary a counterweight. Set-up and tear down are quick and easy. I don't think I'll be doing any close-up prom animations with this set-up but for a quick FD or super portable rig it ought to do the job. Not sure what that strange striped shading is across the top of the disk but I think I managed to get rid of it in a later shot by rotating the T-scanner.
IMG_6049.JPG
IMG_6049.JPG (1.06 MiB) Viewed 2268 times
Sun_113009_2.jpg
Sun_113009_2.jpg (336.77 KiB) Viewed 2268 times


Christopher

"Our imagination is stretched to the utmost, not, as in fiction, to imagine things which are not really there, but just to comprehend those things which 'are' there.". -Feynman
User avatar
marktownley
Librarian
Librarian
Posts: 42274
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2011 5:27 pm
Location: Brierley Hills, UK
Has thanked: 20442 times
Been thanked: 10248 times
Contact:

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by marktownley »

Looks a good result! a nice setup too.


Image
http://brierleyhillsolar.blogspot.co.uk/
Solar images, a collection of all the most up to date live solar data on the web, imaging & processing tutorials - please take a look!
User avatar
Christopher
Im an EXPERT!
Im an EXPERT!
Posts: 221
Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:07 am
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA
Has thanked: 33 times
Been thanked: 34 times

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by Christopher »

Thanks Mark! It occurred to me that this light path passes through elements created by David Lunt, Del Woods and Mark Wagner....arguably 3 of the most influential amateur H-alpha equipment makers in the U.S. Kinda cool. I failed to mention the shot was taken yesterday around 11:30 AM EDT.


Christopher

"Our imagination is stretched to the utmost, not, as in fiction, to imagine things which are not really there, but just to comprehend those things which 'are' there.". -Feynman
Astrophil
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 903
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2018 2:00 am
Been thanked: 581 times

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by Astrophil »

Christopher, that is some "minimalist" setup. All the good stuff in one small package. Very nice first image and they will improve with a little tweaking. Made in the USA, well how about that? Looking forward to seeing more.

Phil


User avatar
Christopher
Im an EXPERT!
Im an EXPERT!
Posts: 221
Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:07 am
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA
Has thanked: 33 times
Been thanked: 34 times

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by Christopher »

Thanks Phil. I think it's going to be a fun set up to use when time is limited which these days seems often. If we're going to credit manufacturer nations we'll have to include Japan (Borg) if we're stopping at the focus point :lol: I was able to rotate that shadow/reflection pattern out by turning the T-scanner relative to the front etalon. Here's another image from 14:04 EDT same session. A bit cleaner.
Sun_140343_D2.1.jpg
Sun_140343_D2.1.jpg (246.11 KiB) Viewed 2227 times


Christopher

"Our imagination is stretched to the utmost, not, as in fiction, to imagine things which are not really there, but just to comprehend those things which 'are' there.". -Feynman
User avatar
Merlin66
Librarian
Librarian
Posts: 3970
Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:23 pm
Location: Junortoun, Australia
Has thanked: 173 times
Been thanked: 615 times
Contact:

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by Merlin66 »

Christopher,
You seem to have ended up with distinct banding across the whole disk????


"Astronomical Spectroscopy - The Final Frontier" - to boldly go where few amateurs have gone before
https://groups.io/g/astronomicalspectroscopy  
http://astronomicalspectroscopy.com
"Astronomical Spectroscopy for Amateurs" and
"Imaging Sunlight - using a digital spectroheliograph" - Springer
User avatar
Christopher
Im an EXPERT!
Im an EXPERT!
Posts: 221
Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:07 am
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA
Has thanked: 33 times
Been thanked: 34 times

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by Christopher »

I'm not sure if you're referring to the fine horizontal banding or the two vertical shadowy ones. I think the latter could potentially be managed using flats. As for the horizontal stuff....yes. This is strange. I uploaded the exact same file to Astrobin and don't see those artifacts. At least not near as pronounced. I suspect it could be oversharpening and compression artifacts but I'm not sure. Also not sure why the same file renders differently.

Thoughts?

Here's the Astrobin image.

Image


Christopher

"Our imagination is stretched to the utmost, not, as in fiction, to imagine things which are not really there, but just to comprehend those things which 'are' there.". -Feynman
Astrophil
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 903
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2018 2:00 am
Been thanked: 581 times

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by Astrophil »

Christopher, the second image looks better. The vertical band and the horizontal lines might vanish with the use of a flat. The fine lines look like what interlaced cameras produced so I tried a deinterlace filter to remove them. Not too much loss of detail. Sharpening tends to enhance them. Anyway, not very visible unless enlarged a lot. Keep up the good work.

Phil

Here is the de-interlaced version.
Sun_140343_D2.1a.jpg
Sun_140343_D2.1a.jpg (96.87 KiB) Viewed 2177 times


User avatar
Christopher
Im an EXPERT!
Im an EXPERT!
Posts: 221
Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:07 am
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA
Has thanked: 33 times
Been thanked: 34 times

Re: More aperture please (PST)

Post by Christopher »

Thank you for the de-interlace tip Phil. Extremely helpful. :bow2 I also found a video that had quite a bit of drift in it due to long pauses in adequate seeing so I was able to use AutoStakkert to smooth out the vertical banding as well. I think I'll stop here on this session. Many lessons learned :bow and I'm quite pleased with the result given the 40mm of aperture :P .
Sun_134022_1.jpg
Sun_134022_1.jpg (254.06 KiB) Viewed 2158 times


Christopher

"Our imagination is stretched to the utmost, not, as in fiction, to imagine things which are not really there, but just to comprehend those things which 'are' there.". -Feynman
Post Reply