Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

this is the main message area for anything solar :)
Post Reply
User avatar
minhlead
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 682
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2021 9:36 pm
Location: Ha Noi, Vietnam
Has thanked: 738 times
Been thanked: 1104 times
Contact:

Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by minhlead »

I forgot to turn on my DIY active cooler for my Quark and you can see on the video that it gradually goes off band due to the insane ambient temperature (almost 50*C out in the sun light today).
Image
Really should have turned that cooler on. But it's cool seeing the CWL gradually shift due to the rising temperature.


Minh.
Loves from Viet Nam <3
My gear:
Scope: SkyRover (Kunming Optics) 152mm F/6 Doublets
Mount: JTW Tridents GTR
Camera:
PlayerOne Apollo M-Max
Quark Chromosphere Doublestacked with PST etalon
User avatar
cmas
Ohhhhhh My!
Ohhhhhh My!
Posts: 144
Joined: Sat May 06, 2017 5:49 pm
Has thanked: 294 times
Been thanked: 248 times

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by cmas »

Very high quality animation anyway!


H-alpha: Baader D-ERF, Sharpstar 61 EDPH II, Altair Astro 102 f/7, Quark, reducer and ASI174mm.
White light: Baader ASSF 115, Sony SEL 200600G, Sony SEL20TC, Sony A7iii.
Images in AstroBin
Images in Flickr
User avatar
MAURITS
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Posts: 8507
Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:37 pm
Location: Belgium
Has thanked: 2412 times
Been thanked: 4786 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by MAURITS »

Beautiful animation Minh, looks like I seem to see rats walking...


Regards,
Maurits

Vista del Cielo Observatory

www.vistadelcielo.be
User avatar
minhlead
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 682
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2021 9:36 pm
Location: Ha Noi, Vietnam
Has thanked: 738 times
Been thanked: 1104 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by minhlead »

Thanks, Cmas, Maurits.
@Maurits it sure does look like lines of ants


Minh.
Loves from Viet Nam <3
My gear:
Scope: SkyRover (Kunming Optics) 152mm F/6 Doublets
Mount: JTW Tridents GTR
Camera:
PlayerOne Apollo M-Max
Quark Chromosphere Doublestacked with PST etalon
User avatar
Montana
Librarian
Librarian
Posts: 34560
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 5:25 pm
Location: Cheshire, UK
Has thanked: 17667 times
Been thanked: 8788 times

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by Montana »

It's a great animation with lots of activity, but yes, you are gradually entering the red wing ;)

:bow :hamster:

Alexandra


User avatar
marktownley
Librarian
Librarian
Posts: 42272
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2011 5:27 pm
Location: Brierley Hills, UK
Has thanked: 20431 times
Been thanked: 10243 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by marktownley »

This is pretty cool and a nice resource, if you don't mind i'll leave it here a couple of days and then pop it in the solar reference library :)


Image
http://brierleyhillsolar.blogspot.co.uk/
Solar images, a collection of all the most up to date live solar data on the web, imaging & processing tutorials - please take a look!
User avatar
minhlead
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 682
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2021 9:36 pm
Location: Ha Noi, Vietnam
Has thanked: 738 times
Been thanked: 1104 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by minhlead »

marktownley wrote: Wed Jul 28, 2021 3:33 pm This is pretty cool and a nice resource, if you don't mind i'll leave it here a couple of days and then pop it in the solar reference library :)
No problem, Mark


Minh.
Loves from Viet Nam <3
My gear:
Scope: SkyRover (Kunming Optics) 152mm F/6 Doublets
Mount: JTW Tridents GTR
Camera:
PlayerOne Apollo M-Max
Quark Chromosphere Doublestacked with PST etalon
User avatar
Valery
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Posts: 4059
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:13 pm
Has thanked: 156 times
Been thanked: 893 times

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by Valery »

On the other hands, you do have an automatic "Doppler scanner" over spectrum. If this landscape will be at a larger AR with some black filaments, such a "Doppler scanner" should show big changes in pictures. :)

Try this with such an AR.


BTW Your Quark shows here an excellent homogeneity. Or it was flat field corrected?


Valery
Last edited by Valery on Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.


"Solar H alpha activity is the most dynamic and compelling thing you can see in a telescope, so spend accordingly." (c) Bob Yoesle.

Largest full size 185 - 356mm Dielectric Energy Rejection Filters (D-ERF) by ARIES Instruments.
User avatar
minhlead
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 682
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2021 9:36 pm
Location: Ha Noi, Vietnam
Has thanked: 738 times
Been thanked: 1104 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by minhlead »

Valery wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 1:54 am On the other hands, you do have a automatic "Doppler scanner" over spectrum. If this landscape will be at a larger AR with some black filaments, such a "Doppler scanner" should show big changes in pictures. :)

Try this with such an AR.


BTW Your Quark shows here an excellent homogeneity. Or it was flat field corrected?


Valery
Thanks, Valery. I'll try again later as you suggested.
My Quark does have some un-uniformity but I cropped it out with ROI. I use a M4/3 sensor so there are plenty of room to crop.
I also use flats to calibrate my light frames.


Minh.
Loves from Viet Nam <3
My gear:
Scope: SkyRover (Kunming Optics) 152mm F/6 Doublets
Mount: JTW Tridents GTR
Camera:
PlayerOne Apollo M-Max
Quark Chromosphere Doublestacked with PST etalon
User avatar
Carbon60
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Posts: 14205
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:33 pm
Location: Lancashire, UK
Has thanked: 8415 times
Been thanked: 8161 times

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by Carbon60 »

Interesting to see the changing view through the sweep with little filaments popping into the scene.

Stu.


H-alpha, WL and Ca II K imaging kit for various image scales.
Fluxgate Magnetometers (1s and 150s Cadence).
Radio meteor detector.
More images at http://www.flickr.com/photos/solarcarbon60/
User avatar
Rusted
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Posts: 1738
Joined: Fri Jan 19, 2018 11:00 am
Location: Central Denmark
Has thanked: 8016 times
Been thanked: 1938 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by Rusted »

minhlead wrote: Tue Jul 27, 2021 2:19 pm I forgot to turn on my DIY active cooler for my Quark and you can see on the video that it gradually goes off band due to the insane ambient temperature (almost 50*C out in the sun light today).

Really should have turned that cooler on.
But it's cool seeing the CWL gradually shift due to the rising temperature.
An excellent animation with remarkable clarity. :bow

I wonder if your high temperatures have minimised the refractive index differential between thermal air currents?
Was the sun's local altitude almost overhead? Thereby minimising the atmospheric path length.

Have I missed your guide to DIY active camera cooling?
My ASI174 is getting up around 50C after a long day of imaging. Noise increases.
Evaporative cooling has crossed my mind.

An external, blower fan would [probably] be of limited value.
As would adding a sleeve of cooling fins around the camera body.
Much like the cylinder of an air-cooled engine.
A cowled fan and fins for greater efficiency?


http://fullerscopes.blogspot.dk/

H-alpha: Baader 160mm D-ERF, iStar 150/10 H-alpha objective, 2" Baader 35nm H-a, 2" Beloptik KG3,
Lunt 60MT etalon, Lunt B1200S2 BF, Assorted T-S GPCs or 2x "Shorty" Barlow, ZWO ASI174.
User avatar
minhlead
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 682
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2021 9:36 pm
Location: Ha Noi, Vietnam
Has thanked: 738 times
Been thanked: 1104 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by minhlead »

Carbon60 wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 5:30 am Interesting to see the changing view through the sweep with little filaments popping into the scene.

Stu.
It is interesting isn't it? But it also show the effect of high ambient temperature on a Quark. People buying Quarks should be aware of this. Without this knowledge, a lot of Quark users is gonna end up with a Quark that's unusable at their local climate.


Minh.
Loves from Viet Nam <3
My gear:
Scope: SkyRover (Kunming Optics) 152mm F/6 Doublets
Mount: JTW Tridents GTR
Camera:
PlayerOne Apollo M-Max
Quark Chromosphere Doublestacked with PST etalon
User avatar
minhlead
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 682
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2021 9:36 pm
Location: Ha Noi, Vietnam
Has thanked: 738 times
Been thanked: 1104 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by minhlead »

Rusted wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 5:33 am I wonder if your high temperatures have minimised the refractive index differential between thermal air currents?
Was the sun's local altitude almost overhead? Thereby minimising the atmospheric path length.

Have I missed your guide to DIY active camera cooling?
My ASI174 is getting up around 50C after a long day of imaging. Noise increases.
Evaporative cooling has crossed my mind.

An external, blower fan would [probably] be of limited value.
As would adding a sleeve of cooling fins around the camera body.
Much like the cylinder of an air-cooled engine.
A cowled fan and fins for greater efficiency?
I think if it does anything, the high ambient temperature only worsen seeing due to rising air. I am observing from a rooftop observatory (on the 5th floor) and it's some what help with the near ground rising air. I'd rate the seeing of this particular imaging session 7.5/10.
I am using a cooled QHY294C (a color camera) to do imaging and it's cooled to 0*C which helped a lot with thermal noise. But I am looking to upgrade to a QHY174M and having a thought about making a TEC cooler for the camera itself.
Currently I have a cooler for my Quark which refuses to work correctly when ambient passed 38*C mark which is a given on a sunny day here in VN. If I turn on the cooler (for the Quark) then it's works fine. Below are my DIY topic.
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=31794


Minh.
Loves from Viet Nam <3
My gear:
Scope: SkyRover (Kunming Optics) 152mm F/6 Doublets
Mount: JTW Tridents GTR
Camera:
PlayerOne Apollo M-Max
Quark Chromosphere Doublestacked with PST etalon
User avatar
Florin Andrei
Oh, I get it now!
Oh, I get it now!
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2020 1:52 am
Location: California
Has thanked: 47 times
Been thanked: 30 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by Florin Andrei »

minhlead wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 6:00 am I am using a cooled QHY294C (a color camera) to do imaging and it's cooled to 0*C which helped a lot with thermal noise. But I am looking to upgrade to a QHY174M and having a thought about making a TEC cooler for the camera itself.
So, I'm curious, how much does that matter, really?

I've done planetary photography before, and thermal noise doesn't seem to matter there - you're averaging over so many frames in the stack that the noise just disappears. Is this different in some way?

I had a cooled ASI178MM but I sold it recently because I thought I'll have no real use for it. :( I'm thinking to get an ASI290MM for solar, but of course it has no cooling from the factory.

I just got started with H-alpha photography a few days ago and I'm using now an ASI071MC-Cool - but it's color, and it's huge. Probably not optimal. I have not used the active cooling at all for H-alpha.


--
Florin Andrei
http://florin.myip.org/
User avatar
minhlead
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 682
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2021 9:36 pm
Location: Ha Noi, Vietnam
Has thanked: 738 times
Been thanked: 1104 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by minhlead »

Florin Andrei wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:26 am
minhlead wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 6:00 am I am using a cooled QHY294C (a color camera) to do imaging and it's cooled to 0*C which helped a lot with thermal noise. But I am looking to upgrade to a QHY174M and having a thought about making a TEC cooler for the camera itself.
So, I'm curious, how much does that matter, really?

I've done planetary photography before, and thermal noise doesn't seem to matter there - you're averaging over so many frames in the stack that the noise just disappears. Is this different in some way?

I had a cooled ASI178MM but I sold it recently because I thought I'll have no real use for it. :( I'm thinking to get an ASI290MM for solar, but of course it has no cooling from the factory.

I just got started with H-alpha photography a few days ago and I'm using now an ASI071MC-Cool - but it's color, and it's huge. Probably not optimal. I have not used the active cooling at all for H-alpha.
Dark current noise (which depends on temperature) does not seems to be a problem with solar imaging the same reason it's not for planetary imaging: The exposure time is very short. Dark current is a time and temperature dependent (expressed as -e/sec and varies at given temperature) so with very short exposure, the dark current accumulation is negligible and can be counted out. That's why a lot of planetary (and solar) imager does not take dark frame calibration. Also the plentiful of light in solar-planetary imaging also drown out the dark current generated noise (and read noise for that matter) so they are generally ignored . Hence solar imager does not take bias and dark frames.
But on the other hand, the hot-pixels, which is the pixels that got activated regardless of the signal is the problem here.
The hot-pixel is also temperature dependent (it's an other expression of dark current on defective pixel). The hotter the sensor get, the brighter the hot-pixels get (and there will be more of them too).
Because the solar cameras capture frames very fast (just a few seconds each burst of hundreds if not thousands of frames), the hot pixels tends to be stationary or varies very little on the captured frames due to seeing or mount's tracking drift. And because a lot of stabilization algorithm used on solar stacker (AS3!, Registax...) out there are contrast based, the hot-pixels (which can be considered high contrast features) often got aligned together and stacked even if they have very slight "dither" between frames. So stacking frame may or may not get rid of the hot pixels and I have seen case of hot pixels jumping all around the frames.
So yes, high temperature can affect your output image when imaging solar. Not to mention very high temperature WILL shorten your sensor life and make even more hot-pixel to appear over time when the silicon degrade.
Last edited by minhlead on Thu Jul 29, 2021 10:46 am, edited 1 time in total.


Minh.
Loves from Viet Nam <3
My gear:
Scope: SkyRover (Kunming Optics) 152mm F/6 Doublets
Mount: JTW Tridents GTR
Camera:
PlayerOne Apollo M-Max
Quark Chromosphere Doublestacked with PST etalon
User avatar
arnedanielsen
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Way More Fun to Share It!!
Posts: 7285
Joined: Fri Apr 18, 2014 10:42 pm
Location: Vestby, Norway
Has thanked: 6181 times
Been thanked: 7142 times

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by arnedanielsen »

Very interesting Minh!

Thank you very much for sharing this great example!

Best regards,
Arne


Best regards,
Arne
--
AstroBin: https://www.astrobin.com/users/arnedani/
RodAstro
Im an EXPERT!
Im an EXPERT!
Posts: 385
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2017 9:51 pm
Has thanked: 286 times
Been thanked: 399 times

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by RodAstro »

Very interesting feature you have there.

Cheers Rod


User avatar
minhlead
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 682
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2021 9:36 pm
Location: Ha Noi, Vietnam
Has thanked: 738 times
Been thanked: 1104 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by minhlead »

Thanks, Arne, Rod.


Minh.
Loves from Viet Nam <3
My gear:
Scope: SkyRover (Kunming Optics) 152mm F/6 Doublets
Mount: JTW Tridents GTR
Camera:
PlayerOne Apollo M-Max
Quark Chromosphere Doublestacked with PST etalon
LeoD
Im an EXPERT!
Im an EXPERT!
Posts: 395
Joined: Mon May 04, 2020 2:21 pm
Location: Moscow, Russia
Has thanked: 1262 times
Been thanked: 1057 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by LeoD »

It's an interesting case, Minh, indeed!
What is the time span of animation?
regards
Leo


User avatar
minhlead
Almost There...
Almost There...
Posts: 682
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2021 9:36 pm
Location: Ha Noi, Vietnam
Has thanked: 738 times
Been thanked: 1104 times
Contact:

Re: Timelapse of a Quark gradually going off band

Post by minhlead »

LeoD wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 7:59 pm It's an interesting case, Minh, indeed!
What is the time span of animation?
regards
Leo
Thanks, Leo. It was about 2 hours


Minh.
Loves from Viet Nam <3
My gear:
Scope: SkyRover (Kunming Optics) 152mm F/6 Doublets
Mount: JTW Tridents GTR
Camera:
PlayerOne Apollo M-Max
Quark Chromosphere Doublestacked with PST etalon
Post Reply